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Pirates acquire Davis from Mets

By Dejan Kovacevic | Trib Total Media

The Pirates have acquired first baseman Ike Davis from the New York Mets in exchange for minor-league right-hander Zack Thornton and a player to be named.

Here’s Davis’ official page.

Here’s Davis’ FanGraphs page for more advanced statistics.

Davis, 27, is a left-handed hitter with a lifetime line of .241/.334/.433 over parts of five seasons with the Mets. He also has 68 home runs and 224 RBIs in that time, although it should be noted that 32 of those home runs and 90 of those RBIs all came in a terrific 2012 season. He took a big step backward last season with a .205/.326/.334 line and only nine home runs in 317 at-bats.

No doubt, the Pirates would like to see Davis revisit that 2012 form, but be sure that the Mets did, too.

Here’s a video collection of Davis highlights from that season:

Thornton, 25, is a right-handed reliever who didn’t rate among the Pirates’ top 30 prospects, per Baseball America. He also was going to be needed to be protected in the Rule 5 draft this winter.

Here’s Thornton’s official page.

As with any deal involving a player to be named, there’s no way to discern who wins or loses. Being that it took the Pirates this long to get Davis — they were known to be discussing him pretty much all winter — one would think the Mets were holding out. Thornton’s no prize, so it’s possible the Mets caved. But again, a player to be named can be almost anything. Sandy Alderson has done a good job of stockpiling prospects in New York, and I find it close to unfathomable he’d give up a player of Davis pedigree for a next-to-nothing reliever without something significant accompanying that.

This obviously spells doom for Travis Ishikawa, I’d think. Gaby Sanchez sat for most of the opening week, but you’ll recall that the plan all through spring was for Sanchez to be the main guy in the platoon, even if that had been with Andrew Lambo. That’s not entirely surprising, as it relates to Ishikawa. If Neal Huntington and crew had thought that much of Ishikawa in the first place, you’d never have heard of the allegedly cemented Sanchez/Lambo platoon.

Where the Pirates do well here is by paying only $3.5 million in salary this season, as well as having two additional years of control through arbitration. Not much risk is assumed.

The big question, of course, is this: Will Davis hit again?

The Mets obviously didn’t think so, or they would have kept him over Lucas Duda. In January, ESPN’s Adam Rubin compiled this string of quotes from scouts asking which player the Mets should keep. Duda was the marginal winner.

The pluses on Davis is that he’s got that power — never underestimate that as an enticing factor, especially if he could get it done at the cavern that is Citi Field — that he’s got a good eye in terms of drawing walks, that he’s solid defensively and that he’s young enough to overcome a season like the one he just had. The minuses are that he’s injury-prone, that he strikes out a ridiculous 24 percent of the time and that he isn’t wild about taking coaches’ advice or changing his approach at the plate.

That last one won’t fly under Clint Hurdle, I’ll tell you that. He’ll want Jeff Branson to be all over Davis, and he’ll follow through on it directly given how heavily involved the manager still is at guiding hitters.

It’ll be interesting to watch this play out, not just from Davis’ own development but also from how — and if — Sanchez can go back to his strongest suit of hitting lefties hard. Davis, by contrast, is lousy against lefties but has an .824 career OPS against righties. I know platoon is a dirty word to a lot of folks with the Pirates, but there’s no crime in a good one.

UPDATE 8:07 p.m.: Huntington says, ‘Hopefully, this is a move that solves our first-base needs for years to come.’ The GM also openly states that Davis will share the position with Sanchez, so Ishikawa is, indeed, out.

That and much more in Rob Biertempfel’s news coverage.

8:24 p.m.: The New York Daily News reports that the player to be named will be ‘more significant’ than Thornton.

Author: Dejan Kovacevic

Dejan Kovacevic, a lifelong Pittsburgher, is an award-winning sports columnist for Trib Total Media covering the Steelers, Penguins, Pirates, Pitt and, recently, his fourth Olympics in Sochi, Russia. He also appears on WPXI-TV's 'Subway Final Word’ and hosts a weekly show on TribLIVE Radio. For 2011, he was named one of the country's top four columnists by the AP Sports Editors. For 2012, he was named one of the country's top three columnists by the National Headliners. For 2013, he was named the state's top columnist by the Keystone Press Awards and top columnist in Western Pennsylvania by the Golden Quills.

Comments

  1. Milo Hamilton says:

    Wait a minute, I thought you weren’t allowed to make trades in April.

  2. theplanisworking says:

    ++++++++++

    Davis is NOT a QO player, right?
    Which means, no pick involved?

    Or have I goofed, and misremembered the 25 or so 1B available …..

  3. Baywatch says:

    Gotta sting Gaby, after his recent surge!

  4. Andrew says:

    Dumpster diving again.

  5. Barb says:

    No just a member of the reclamation club.

  6. theplanisworking says:

    Davis should do well with the short RF in PNC.
    Don’t have a clue what his defense is like.

    Kudos to Neal for getting him. Would have been nice to have had this issue cleared up in the offseason, but oh well.
    Wonder who the PTBNL is going to be?

  7. Stuart says:

    Hardly dumpster diving Andrew.

    Let’s wait & see. Maybevwe’ll see the 2012 Ike Davis.
    Stuart

  8. roger johnson says:

    Goodbye Ishi!!!!

  9. Baywatch says:

    Guess time will tell if he’s really as good as Gaby. BUT, that being said, I’d say no more than they’re giving up THIS might make a nice platoon.

  10. Bill says:

    So we added another hitter who strikes out a lot and can’t get on base. Splendid. I would rather go with Travis Isikawa.

  11. Daquido_Bazzini says:

    Davis is not a savior, but I give the Regime credit for taking notice that this present line up is not going to cut it.
    I’ll take it and I won’t complain.
    Some on Twitter are saying there is also a player to be named later in the deal, and they speculate it could be Lambo.
    Again…I’m happy to see some addition to this team.

  12. Andrew says:

    Sorry I was joking, my emoticon didn’t show up. It is certainty buy low Davis has performed worse each season since 2011. Interesting to see who the named later is, because Thronton was Rule 5 eligible.

    Meanwhile the Brewers are collapsing.

  13. steve says:

    The yankees were interested in davis just a week ago this is a great get by the pirates and gave up very little of the future assuming the ptbnl isnt anyone crazy. Davis isnt babe ruth but he is an upgrade. He is the upgrade the fan base has been clammoring about all offseason. And he is only 27 and will have alot less pressure on him in the burgh. Dont be suprised to see a resurgance

  14. JBDestiny says:

    nine total bases from five hits (1 hit was a HR) .. he ROCKS MY WORLD!

  15. bpn8pitt says:

    Mixed feelings.

    Don’t think its a dumpster dive Andrew, but I do feel Dejans line about the 2012 is spot on.

    That big season came after the Citi Field fences were brought in. RC in PNC and Citi is almost identical. RF line of PNC is ten feet shorter.

    Its kind of one of those moves born out of bad circumstances, to steal a line from a favorite journalist. But I’m glad it was made.

  16. theplanisworking says:

    ++++++++++++

  17. Kraig Koelsch says:

    I’m OK with moves like this. It’s low risk and the Mets no doubt hoped to get much more before the ’14 season began. I doubt the PTBNL will be anyone of substance. Good deal.

  18. SeanE says:

    Gotta give Neal a lot of credit. Sorry DK but if the lead player in that trade is Zack Thorton it is clear the mets have caved. A PTBNL this early in the season is not an impact player or prospect. This early in the year teams will just part with the player because there are no minor league playoff games to impact when the prospect is sent. In other words it won’t be a Duke Wlker type of prospect. Likely a lower level prospect or even a compensation draft pick.

  19. JRay3 says:

    Only 24 AB’s and 6 walks in 12 games, Mets committed to Duca. That HR was a PH GS in extras to give the Mets the win.

    I’ll wait for a far more significant sample size before doling out what he has done in minimum PA’s.

  20. Daquido_Bazzini says:

    Now….If they could only add corn dogs to the menu at PNC Park….lol.

  21. Nevres says:

    Seems like we are always after the miracle projects, eventually some pan out, we need a hitting miracle worker like Searage is for pitching

  22. JBDestiny says:

    Justin Morneau is batting .346 in Colorado this season.. it’s a dead horse.. I know

  23. theplanisworking says:

    Baby steps, Daquido, baby steps. :)

  24. bpn8pitt says:

    What I would like to know is, since Laroche left, how much money and assets have been used to address 1b? Nothing outrageous, I know, but it hasn’t exactly been a smooth, cheap process either.

    I know I coined the dumpster diving phrase that many abhor. But had they swung a deal or signed someone significant a few years ago, this may not have been necessary. And I’m not saying Davis is good or will succeed, but sometimes its better just to buy the new reliable car, than get nickeled and dimed on the used cars other people didn’t want.

    Will be watching at the gym. Pirate 5k tommorow.

  25. RK says:

    As a Mets fan I can tell you Ike has tremendous power potential but his swing has been completely screwed up for two years ever since he hurt his ankle and missed the almost the entire 2011 season. He’s one of those guys with a lot of moving parts and its very hard for him to get a consistent swing together. Despite being a great guy and loved by his teammates, he is a bit of a head case in terms of once things starts to go badly he has a lot of trouble calming down and righting the ship. A smaller market might do him wonders but he’s basically had one good half season since 2010. Even that half was only homer runs, not a lot else. Its a good move to take a flier but I would keep my expectations low. As for the PTBNL, some of the Mets writers were told this is possibly the reason the Mets took Thorton because they were getting a good player later on so I wouldn’t be so sure its a complete dump of several average players by the Pirates.

  26. The Gunner says:

    Lambo could be the PTBNL, he sure is blocked in Pgh

  27. Arriba Wilver says:

    If we can’t afford Thornton for Ike we’re in deep do do. Don’t know the PTBM, of course.

  28. The Gunner says:

    Morneau is history, get over it

  29. JBDestiny says:

    now you’re just showing off.. I agree with you BTW..

  30. JBDestiny says:

    you may correct, hopefully you are. AJ Burnett made the switch from Gotham to Pittsburgh and things went well.

  31. Arriba Wilver says:

    I don’t know. Hard to know what it would have taken earlier. Lots of criticism they didn’t get Byrd sooner last year, and that worked out OK.

  32. JBDestiny says:

    DK, when can we expect to see him in the lineup?

  33. Daquido_Bazzini says:

    That’s baloney what Maldonado just did to Mercer.
    That’s intent to injure.

  34. Arriba Wilver says:

    If you coined “dumpster dive” I’m a Model T. ;-)

  35. KING says:

    Ike Davis trade a good one for Pirates. They have a power hitter in his prime years with years of control.

    Gives Pirates good depth at 1B & Davis is a mysterious enough player fans can guess his future good or bad.

    Score another A grade trade for Neal The Prophet. KING

  36. SeanE says:

    Could not agree more. He should be suspended toe that one. Heck, in the NFL he might have been fined a years pay.

  37. Reading says:

    Wow! Watching that highlight package, this guy is a home run/double machine! Does he ever make an out? Wow!!

  38. LH says:

    Speaking of lineup improvements, Polanco has 2 hits and 3 rbi already tonight

  39. bpn8pitt says:

    NMR has it in the D cell, on the spreadsheet. ;)

  40. RK says:

    If you can get his swing straightened out he’s a 30-35 HR guy easily. Probably though better off in a platoon because he’s pretty useless vs lefties. When he was going bad it looked like a little leaguer swinging the bat especially vs. breaking balls. He’s a good dude so I wish him well.

  41. JBDestiny says:

    .. took me a second.. bravo

  42. Eric Bowser says:

    Hopefully PTBNL will not be anything of note but I like the deal, low risk.

  43. theplanisworking says:

    According to SNY, there is a bigger piece involved as to the PTBN.
    They do not mention who it could be.
    Stay tuned.

  44. I would certainly hope that Ike Davis will be the first baseman the Bucs have so long needed.

  45. Andrew says:

    Speculation is that it is a 2013 draft pick, here is the list. Mets could have got Thornton in the Rule 5.

    http://pittsburgh.pirates.mlb.com/team/draft.jsp?c_id=pit

  46. RK says:

    “@AndrewHarts: Sandy said they’re happy with the PTBNL. “It’s a player to be named later for a reason”.” This to me says it’s ’13 draftee

    FYI – the Sandy in question below is the Mets GM. The reason it is believed that the player is from the 2013 draft is because 2013 draftees can’t be traded until a year has passed since their signing date, so it makes sense that he won’t be announced until that happens in a few months

  47. theplanisworking says:

    Meadows and McGuire HAVE to be off that list, correct?

  48. Andrew says:

    Yes, unless someone is drunk. I cannot remember all the rumors of the Mets demands for Davis over the winter, but supposedly the Orioles balked at the demands for Eduardo Rodriguez, Baseball Prospectus had him as #61 pre-2014. But hitters are always more valuable than pitchers.

  49. Stlrfanrc (Ryan) says:

    Abso-freaking-lutely.

    In other words, I sure hope so

  50. Thundercrack says:

    Our season is saved!!

    And does this mean the FO cares about first base? Finally.

  51. Baywatch says:

    +++

  52. Stlrfanrc (Ryan) says:

    I have zero issue with this trade. Shocked that it happened so early in the season, but I’m sure it’s been brewing for awhile.

    I think PNC plays well for Ike and I also have NO problem with this platoon.

    Two mashers of the opposite delivery, decent price tag in combination.

    They will put up good, respectable numbers combined than what 1 full time high priced dude does.

  53. theplanisworking says:

    Well, people have said the Pirates cared before when such luminaries as Adam LaRoche, Kevin Young, and Jason Thompson were brought in.

    I do know it is an upgrade.
    I also know Ike isn’t the second coming of Willie Stargell.

  54. JBDestiny says:

    Can we get some insight? When is Ike Ike Davey going to play, what does this mean for Ishikawa who has a better BA (ha!) and also bats from the left.. where’s the million dollar columnist?? C’mon DK! if not insight, how ’bout some analysis! (oh wait, you’re at the game.. sorry, okay.. don’t read this message until 10pm EST)

  55. 21sthebest says:

    I don’t know about anybody else, but I never mentioned Jason Thompson or LaRoche. All I said about Young was that he had a couple of good years.

  56. Stlrfanrc (Ryan) says:

    Plan…I believe that’s only for free agent signings. I.e Stephen Drew

  57. Jim S. says:

    Ike adds whiffs, walks, more HR to the lineup. Decent glove. FWIW, he has a career .828 OPS vs. RHP. There’s talent there – if his head is right.

  58. Thundercrack says:

    I mentioned LaRoche.

    And I’m not putting words I your mouth, but it seems that you think if they don’t have a superstar/all star at first base then they don’t care about it. I don’t agree

  59. theplanisworking says:

    And I didn’t mention you at all !!
    Have a great night !! :)

  60. Jim S. says:

    Ish is gone. Huntington said as much.

  61. Stlrfanrc (Ryan) says:

    They’re saying the PTBNL is more significant than Thorton, which isn’t that hard to do.

    My guess is this unknown player is the main piece and Thorton was a kicker.

  62. Feel bad for Lambo, but he had his ST chance. Probably about all he’ll ever get with us.

  63. Stlrfanrc (Ryan) says:

    Whoa, Daq with something positive…..very impressive.

    And spot on post

  64. theplanisworking says:

    I have stated that there has been no good player at first since Stargell. Others have said there were good players, with which I disagree. I believe it’s called opinions.

    I stand by my comment 100%. The Pirates have brought in players who maybe, just maybe could fill the bill, but they haven’t traded for, or developed a legit 1B for decades.

    Doesn’t have to be an all-star, but I expect better than Jeff Clement.

  65. Stlrfanrc (Ryan) says:

    For sure now

  66. theplanisworking says:

    He had chances with the Dodgers also.
    Maybe he sticks with Indy, but who knows.

  67. Jim S. says:

    No one’s drunk.

  68. The Gunner says:

    Lambo will either be the PTBNL or be left unprotected & get claimed in the Rule 5 Draft next winter.

  69. Jim S. says:

    That was dirty. Plenty of punks on this team.

  70. Jim S. says:

    +++.

  71. Jim S. says:

    Interesting thought, Gunner.

  72. 21sthebest says:

    I know. You didn’t mention anyone as usual.

  73. Stlrfanrc (Ryan) says:

    Plan,

    I’ve tried to come up with a decent 1b to argue with you, because I like doing it so much, but I can’t.

    Others have been adequate, at best.

    Honestly, that’s exactly what WAS wrong with the Pirates all these years.

    Sure, they had Bonds, Bonilla back in the day, but they haven’t developed any superstars at any position. This is to include Jason Bay.

    Look at the team, the minors, they are developing super stars right now and…….I just lost my train of thought.

    Long story short. I agree 100% with you on Pops, he sure was special.

  74. Bizrow says:

    Ok, we will see what happens, lets win this one tonight

    The better Ike does the more it will hurt with the PTBN

  75. ericdew30 says:

    Will the Buc’s bat Ike 4th and drop Pedro to 5th or 6th were he seems more comfortable?

  76. theplanisworking says:

    Have a great night !! :)

  77. Gino says:

    Gabby is NOT good. Gabby could fall asleep for the next 5 months and nobody would notice. Have you watched him play the last couple of years? Quit rewarding and rejoicing over below avg players. That’s why you are a Pirates fan.

  78. DocJean says:

    From us “old folk” the platoon of Dick Stuart and Rocky Nelson worked out pretty well in 1960!!

  79. Gino says:

    How do you grade it an A? Davis has yet to put on a pirates uniform. So many pirate fans just drink the Kool aid. You should demand more than just bobble heads and fireworks.

  80. theplanisworking says:

    Tee-totaller. ;)

  81. Jim S. says:

    Good point, Biz. I wonder how long they’ll have to decide.

  82. Jim S. says:

    I liked that stream of consciousness moment, Nor Cal.

  83. Jim S. says:

    I may grab a couple of quick ones the way this game is going.

  84. theplanisworking says:

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/06/player-to-be-named-later.html

    Doesn’t say, but I believe they have up until the day they announce it.
    The key is, the clubs agree on a pool of players eligible.

  85. Gives him a lot of incentive at Indy.

  86. Jandy says:

    I’ve seen Ike Davis mentioned pro and con on here. I’ll take t his post, Ryan, that’s it’s a good thing for the Bucs and go with that :)

  87. The Gunner says:

    Dick Stuart would be making $10 million a year if he was playing now

  88. 21sthebest says:

    6 months.

  89. Jandy says:

    To the “old fold” and newbies, if you post your home town, Biz will add it to the list of Dejan’s Lunatics’ Asylum :)

  90. Thundercrack says:

    He’s past being a rule 5 guy

  91. Jim S. says:

    Gunner:

    If Dick Stuart were playing today, he’d be 85 years old.

    Ok, that’s a really old joke that is one of my dad’s favorites.

  92. Arriba Wilver says:

    Hi Doc. Long time, no “see.”

  93. Arriba Wilver says:

    I’d be surprised. I think Pedro is #4 for the duration.

  94. Jim S. says:

    Something to consider here. For all of Davis’ known warts, he does have a career OPS vs. RHP of .828.

    For all of Gaby’s warts, he does have a career OPS vs. LHP of .900.

    Now, I’m not saying these guys will definitely combine for something like an .840 OPS. But, it is not out of the realm of possibility that they could combine for something like that. So, it is hard to not see this as an upgrade IMO.

    An OPS of .840 could be something like a .370 OB% and a .470 SLG%. That would have to be above the fold as far as NL 1b combos go.

    And, I think they have decent gloves.

  95. Bizrow says:

    I think, but I may be wrong again, the PBTNL could also depend on how Ike does, similar to hockey trades

  96. Bizrow says:

    Lets just get a win tonight, tomorrow will figure itself out ;-)

    Right now, rally hats on

  97. theplanisworking says:

    Bottom line for me,

    Davis >>>>>> Ishi and Lambo.

  98. TJ Meissner says:

    PTBNL…..Vin Mazarro

  99. Jandy says:

    Mine is on!

  100. The Gunner says:

    The big guns are coming up

  101. Jandy says:

    ahh crap!

  102. Jandy says:

    There’s one BOOM, now for a couple more!

  103. Breakthestreak says:

    Davis stinks- trust me. I live in New York area now and the fans despise him. His swing and the moving parts to it look like Alvarez on his worst day. He is a bottom of the barrel signing and shows just how cheap the Bucs still are . What a shame .

  104. Bizrow says:

    IMO worry abut Davis tomorrow. Not to diss on anyone, a change of scenery can help and it depends on what the PBC gave up for him

    Win this game

  105. Stuart says:

    “Petey” strikes out with the bat on his shoulder, and the toeing runs in scoring position. That makes 7 (count em) runners stranded. As Yogi used to say “it’s Deja Vu all over again”.

    Stuart (who BTW hit 66 HRs in Lincoln Nebraska before he played for the Bucs)

  106. Stuart says:

    Make that “tying”

    Stonefingers Stuart

  107. Bizrow says:

    We will miss Pedro when he is gone, Stu

  108. radio wave says:

    Agree. You don’t fix a mistake with another mistake.

  109. Stlrfanrc (Ryan) says:

    Ted Williams Jim

  110. Jim S. says:

    Well, if the NY fans hate him, then he has to stink. Because they know everything.

  111. Jim S. says:

    Exactly, Nor Cal. It is a Ted Williams line. ABout Ty Cobb, I believe. My dad loves to tell it.

  112. bpn8pitt says:

    Reading some of the Mets blogs and ESPN, SI.com comments-Mets fans say Davis can’t hit breaking stuff to save his life and is another guy with plate discipline issues.

    So there’s that.

  113. Jandy says:

    ZING!

  114. Daquido_Bazzini says:

    If I had half the luck of the Brewers, I’d win the lottery tonight.

  115. DJ says:

    When I see the stream of effusive comments about a Bucs trade mere minutes after the start of a new thread, tempered by just a few negatives to add seeming balance and legitimacy, I get a little skeptical.

    The baseball guys will undoubtedly know who regularly posts on the Bucs blogs but my questions are these: Who are all these unrecognizable snowmen coming out of the woods to add their two cents? And do the Bucs have a paid blogger (or bloggers) whose job it is to sway public perception?

  116. Jandy says:

    Tread lightly ;)

  117. Bizrow says:

    Federal Street is listed as a site on Dejan’s Lunatic Nation ;)

  118. DJ says:

    Hey, I’m a snowman.

    I get to ask the tough questions.

  119. DJ says:

    Too funny!

  120. Baywatch says:

    Kind of a small tidbit, but a good feel for me. Turns out, Ike Davis is the son of former late ’70s/early ’80s Yankees reliever-closer Ron Davis, one of my favorites from back then! I also got to see him pitch when I lived in Memphis and watched a lot of Cubs games, 1986-87.

  121. Sisyphus says:

    Everybody would notice every time a lefthander is on the mound.

  122. Milo Hamilton says:

    I remember him sporting a 23.14 ERA in the 1981 World Series for the Yankees. Sins of the father.

  123. Arriba Wilver says:

    The question about Davis has been all through the offseason what was it worth giving up for him, including from very harsh critics.

    This recent trend, apparently started by Jandy, of making up imaginary people to explain things away people don’t like, is very troubling. Haven’t seen any overly effusive praise of this move yet. Why don’t we wait and see?

  124. Sisyphus says:

    Davis does strike out a lot, but he has a career OBP of .357 against righties. That’s a very good OBP. He had a horrible year last year and still put up a .356 OBP against righties. He gets on base just fine.

  125. Jim S. says:

    He hit 32 HR in 2012. That was some half season.

    He’s being brought into take 70% of the ABs. They aren’t expecting another Cutch. They know what they are getting.

  126. Jandy says:

    I started no trend, AW, but when ANYONE here tries to “buck” the trend, this is what gets started … again…by you.

    I don’t need “imaginary friends” to start anything. ANyone can see what goes on around here.
    Happy Easter, my dear friend :)

  127. Baywatch says:

    You do any exorcising?

  128. Sisyphus says:

    Well, Davis makes 3-1/2 times more that Ishikawa, and 7 times as much as Lambo, so how could he complain?

  129. Jim S. says:

    I didn’t know that, Bay.

  130. Baywatch says:

    Jim, I didn’t either until they mentioned it on the broadcast! In the Wikipedia article I read about him, it said he was one of the first straight set-up guys used in the game, him and Goose Gossage taking it home in 1980 and ’81 for the Yankees.

  131. Sisyphus says:

    If Davis doesn’t get his swing straightened out and instead repeats his terrible 2013, he’s another 2013 Garrett Jones. The Pirates managed to win 94 games with Jones providing almost nothing last year.

  132. Jim S. says:

    With Davis, I would just say … he can hit HR and he can draw walks. And, he can strike out … a lot. We didn’t trade for Joey Votto here. We traded for a guy whose career says he is an upgrade from Travis Ishikawa. But, he comes with plenty of baggage. I think it makes us a bit better. I think Polanco will make us better, too.

    Maybe Ike (and Tina) Davis will show up motivated, and put together a decent season. He has hit RHP pretty well, and that’s what he is here to do.

    Happy Easter all!

  133. Sisyphus says:

    We rarely agree, but you nailed that one.

  134. Jim S. says:

    Well, it is true that the Yanks were pioneers with the bullpen in those days, Bay.

  135. Jandy says:

    You too, Jimster!

  136. Baywatch says:

    Happy Easter to you, too, Jim! Hey, I figure since Ike Davis’ father was a pitcher, maybe Uncle Ray can … BUAHAHA!

  137. Sisyphus says:

    The Pirates didn’t have any star first basemen since Stargell, but they haven’t exactly been terrible there for all that time, either.

  138. Sisyphus says:

    So you’re saying that anything less than a HOF player at any position is a management failure?

  139. Sisyphus says:

    Lambo is on the 40 man roster. The rule 5 draft is for players who are not on the 40 man roster.

  140. Milo Hamilton says:

    You left out the part about him being terrible. :)

  141. Sisyphus says:

    Yes, we all know how knowledgeable those savvy NY fans are from their accurate assessment of A.J. Burnett a couple of years ago.

  142. Thundercrack says:

    I certainly hope Ike Davis does well and think there is some good upside there. And it will be interesting to see exactly what the acquisition price is.

    But I think there are some issues with his swing. And I would have been fine with giving Lambo a shot for a month or so.

  143. bpn8pitt says:

    Yea, I definitely noticed an influx of both pro and antis alike. Some of whom I haven’t seen in awhile. Some I’ve never seen before.

  144. DJ says:

    Well aware on your first point, AW. You could not read a day without all the handwringing over 1B.

    On the second point, who said I “don’t like” the trade or that anyone is making up “imaginary people”? I asked two questions.

    And one question for you since I’m curious: Have you ever seen “KING” post here or on any other Bucs blog before?

  145. DJ says:

    That was the reason the questions were directed to our blog’s baseball regulars in particular.

  146. Arriba Wilver says:

    DJ–I guess I got my wires crossed or at least confused. I wasn’t saying you didn’t like the trade. I have no idea. It was the jump to the “outsiders” I didn’t get, and I don’t even know if they were pro or anti on the trade.

    On”king” I couldn’t find him/her. You have a time?

    Now, back at ya, were you in favor of Scappers post about the Pens thread or did you think he was full of it?

  147. Arriba Wilver says:

    I agree with you Jandy that anyone who gives it some thought knows what’s going on here. But I’m pretty sure we think those conclusions are very different.

    We aren’t friends. That would be continuing the fake nature of what’s going on.

  148. Arriba Wilver says:

    But there wasn’t an influx of comments commending the trade. Thats what I didn’t get.

  149. Bizrow says:

    Panic on Federal ST????

  150. Arriba Wilver says:

    Nah, just Neal being Neal. Waited for the deal that fit within their parameters I expect. But also a recognition that what we had wasn’t enough. Hard to criticize that view.

  151. Cal Hammer says:

    Do U really want a guy batting clean-up (4th) who has a LIFETIME AVG. of .180.8 only 18 HR’s 66 for 365 when batting 5th he’s 144 for 526 27 HR’s 93 RBI’s and a .273 BA. 6th he’s a .250 hitter 157 for 627 35 HR’s 108 RBI’s!! Davis is a LIFETIME .240 hitter batting clean-up!!!

  152. DJ says:

    I thought you might not have read it, AW, so I’ll save you the trouble of locating it:

    “KING
    April 18, 2014 at 7:52 PM

    Ike Davis trade a good one for Pirates. They have a power hitter in his prime years with years of control. Gives Pirates good depth at 1B & Davis is a mysterious enough player fans can guess his future good or bad. Score another A grade trade for Neal The Prophet. KING”

    Having come home from dinner and having read the Ike trade thread only before posting above — not the game thread — I did not view my post as putting forth a “hot button” issue, just an observation. Since then, I’ve read a few posts on the game thread and now have some context.

    On your question, forget about scappers’ post (because I may not remember his comment and any ensuing firestorm precisely — there have been a few lately and they’re running together for me) and I’ll say two things about this blog, the only one on which I post.

    First, I thoroughly enjoy the knowledge, observations, opinions, personalities, banter, discourse, creativity, humor (except for Milo) and camaraderie expressed by the overwhelming majority of those who post here.

    Second, I think it’s everyone’s prerogative to read, post or do both — with those who post hopefully reading a little bit first. What I find silly though is someone coming on the blog and then stating “That’s why I don’t post here anymore” (they just did) or “That’s why I stopped commenting upon [insert Pittsburgh team] because of all the [negativity / Pollyanna positivity"]. Who cares? I want to read what those who WANT to post have to say. It’s a blog and a melting pot of sorts. I enjoy that.

  153. Arriba Wilver says:

    Thanks, DJ. I had missed that, and it does sound canned, and may have in fact come from Federal Street. Like I said, I hadn’t seen it.

    And I agree that it’s everyone’s prerogative to do the things you mentioned. SeanAY seems to be the guy you were referring to in your second part. He used to post a lot, and hadn’t for a long time. I think he also may call some games, like Milo, out where he lives. I don’t interpret what he said the same way you do. He came out of the blue.

    I don’t, however, think it’s “sane” to suggest that if someone’s point of view disagrees with yours (not you specifically) that they were put up to it by others who you disagree with (again, not you specifically) or to suggest that the people you (not you specifically) disagree with are really not as numerous as they seem, but rather are posting under multiple names. That, to me, is insane. Or, at least is an attempt to minimize legitimate discourse.

    Thanks for reading,

    Arriba Wilver (and all the other names I post under).

  154. Ken Jataimu says:

    Maybe the second coming of John Milner? I’d take that.

  155. War_Horse says:

    +++

  156. Ed says:

    Another bad move by huntington. Hmmm…let’s see Justin Morneau hitting .346 for Rocks. Could have traded for Trumbo…ripping it up in Arizona. Instead we pick up guy who can’t hit his way out of a baggie. Enough of the barely above the Mendoza line players.

  157. Thundercrack says:

    Of course I should probably wait until I know who the PTBNL is, but I don’t think NH panicked. I think he would have been fine with Ishi and then Lambo…and the reevaluate at the trade deadline ( I would have too).

    I think NH may have felt he had the leverage and could wait. There may have been panic in NYC.

  158. theplanisworking says:

    Nice of you to whitewash history.

    I think the boulder rolled back over you a few times…..

  159. theplanisworking says:

    Nice twist.
    And, no.

    Have a great day !! :)

  160. DJ says:

    Thanks, AW, but I think something is getting lost here.

    First, “stream” of effusive comments was hyerbole by me. To be fair, and accurate, there were just a few posts of this nature, but they hit around the same time by snowmen with initials and names not recognizable to me, which prompted my questions on their legitimacy directed to the dedicated baseball bloggers (of which I consider you one) including those who read multiple baseball blogs since I don’t.

    I think mine were valid questions. You, bpn8pitt and Bizrow have now answered, which I appreciate. And while Bizrow tossed in humor for good measure, there is some echoing by each of you of my observation. The post by “KING”, in particular, struck me as very canned as well. As an aside, I also don’t think SeanE who posted above is the SeanAY (Western Michigan guy, right?) that you mention.

    On your second point, as I stated above, I later read a few posts on the game thread and now have context for your inital response. I’m interpreting your second point as not being directed to me at all, both because you say so three times AND because my initial post had nothing to do with anyone disagreeing with me since I offered no opinion on the trade at all. I also did not suggest that people here were posting under multiple names, so your “insanity” comment, at least as it relates to my post in particular, does not follow.

    All that being said, I understand now what prompted your comments. Of course, you can always hash it out directly if you consider it important.

  161. According to DK, he gave up nothing as yet. Somebody posted the PTBNL would be Mazarro. Hope not, but he definitely is not on the 40-man.

    I just hope it’s not any prospect with the proverbial high upside. As for the rest, that’s what they’re for. I think NH made a smart move and my office is not on Federal St. I wanted him fired a couple years ago. But you’re correct I believe, that he had the leverage.

  162. Thundercrack says:

    VM could have been claimed on waivers a week ago. So it makes me doubt he is the PTBNL

  163. DJ, I enjoy your posts and I believe everyone does. You are far from a problem here. I enjoy everyone’s input, believe me, as there is none around here where I live. Even my 4 sons have become disinterested in sports, sometimes to my chagrin.

    I think many are becoming defensive on here and there’s no need for it. I thought the same thing as you about all the unrecognizable names on the trade thread. The KING one was especially strange. NH the prophet. I know what a prophet is an he ain’t one.

    That said, we should enjoy the coming days. We can analyze and re-analyze this trade, the one’s not made and never made and nobody is hurt, hopefully.

    ;)

  164. hockeymonster says:

    Can Pyatt play 1B? Big LH hitter, projects as prototypical 1st basemen.

  165. Milo Hamilton says:

    That one really left a mark.

  166. Arriba Wilver says:

    Thanks, DJ. And you are right, and I will hash it out directly. I apologize if I was wrong, but the only reason I directed anything to you about “sanity” was this comment by you directed to Jandy:

    “Looked like hell broke loose but thought you did a helluva job instilling sanity — as always.”

    But I have no beef with you. I didn’t have a beef with anybody until yesterday.

    I see you as a hockey guy and enjoy your posts, which seem pretty sane to me. ;-)

  167. Arriba Wilver says:

    Yes, and why wait? I do hope it isn’t one of the first 2 draft choices from last year. But Biz made a good point, too. It could depend on how Ike does.

  168. Andrew says:

    Taylor Pyatt = Brandon Inge.

  169. DJ says:

    “Neal The Prophet” was certainly the kicker for me, Lucky. And I guess you would know one when you’ve seen one.

    And by the way, I did not interpret AW as suggesting I was “a problem” so it’s all good.

    Moving on to more important topics: Let’s keep it rolling, Pens!

  170. I’ll go back to my desire for Neal to be fired if he lets Meadows or McGuire be part of any trade. Those guys are keepers. But last year’s draft was loaded, IMHO. There could be some more from it that would be appealing to many.

    I believe those 2 guys rank in the 99% untouchable group with Josh Bell, Taillon and some others.

  171. Thundercrack says:

    I don’t think that happens in baseball: the player to be named later is based on how well the traded player does.

    “Hey Ike, don’t hit another home run because that increases your HR & RBI total and your OBP…which would mean we have to send a better prospect back to the Mets”

  172. Arriba Wilver says:

    Agree 100%. Ike, even if he works out perfectly as a platoon, wouldn’t be worth either of them.

  173. DJ says:

    . . . lasting all of two seconds.

  174. I didn’t think he thought that either, DJ. I was just opining on the fact you aren’t a problem. Personally, I think the problem people are long gone and pretty much police themselves out.
    This group we have is a great bunch. My prayer is we all get along and stay “together” as much as possible. I enjoy everyone on here.

    Lord knows, we’ve lost a lot of good and fun people for whatever reason. I don’t see where greetings should be a reason to go. We greet people when they come in a room. But there is a lot of personal attacking that might run some away. I, for one, would like it to stop. We can disagree without attacking each other. I personally have gone too far in the past and offended people and I purposed to myself not to ever do it again. I slipped up the other day and ripped on scapper for something he said, but I shouldn’t have as I enjoy his input, too.

  175. Arriba Wilver says:

    I thought I’d heard of PTBNL where there was a certain group available, not by results, but by number of games or at bats, and if those weren’t reached then it was a modified group. Again, based on PA’s, not results. (With the assumption if he stinks he wouldn’t be getting the PA’s). But I could be misremembering.

  176. What did Pyatt ever do to you, Andrew?

    ;)

  177. Thundercrack says:

    Oh. That makes sense AW.

  178. Milo Hamilton says:

    I’m just glad I decided to catch up on what I missed. That shot would have gone to waste if I’d never seen it.

  179. Bizrow says:

    Yeah, you guys could be right

  180. Andrew says:

    Haha, I just see both as older former serviceable players, in Inge’s case, above average for a stretch, who did not warrant roster spots on their respective Pittsburgh teams.

  181. JAL says:

    The PTBNL will not be anyone who could be traded now–not Lambo, not VM. Most likely a 2013 draft pick because they can’t be traded until the next draft. Other possibility is a player on the DL but that is less likely.

  182. Thundercrack says:

    Blake Taylor LHP
    JaCoby Jones CF
    Cody Dickson LHP

    Those are the Pirates’ 2013 draft picks, #3-#5. Maybe one of those guys are the PTBNL

  183. Thanks, Joe. Good news. Nobody in their right mind would trade Meadows or McGuire and the rest are good prospects, but no “can’t miss” ones.

  184. Thundercrack says:

    Is tonight’s Pirate game radio only? ( Pens are on Root?)

  185. I thought of Jones, too, TC.

  186. Double-D says:

    The Mets GM said the PTBNL couldn’t be announced yet “for a reason”. To me that means it’s either a 2013 draft choice (they can’t be traded until 1 year after they’re selected) or someone who is injured. I’m cautiously giving NH enough credit that he won’t trade Meadows or McGuire, so it could be a 2nd round or later pick. Another guess is Jeff Locke – he’s on a minor-league rehab assignment.

  187. Thundercrack says:

    I don’t think Locke is on the DL – and it isn’t a minor league rehab. He is on the Indy roster.

  188. FlBucco says:

    Get back to me on how this was a steal when the PTBNL turn out to be Meadows or McGuire…

    Remember – this guy could not win the job over Duda…

  189. Double-D says:

    You’re right Thundercrack – my mistake. He did have an oblique injury in spring training, so it could be that the Mets want to make sure he doesn’t have any setbacks before making it official. A 2013 draft choice is probably more likely though.

  190. Andrew says:

    I think those three names are most logical, but what do I know.

  191. FlBucco says:

    Nope – the PTBNL is known – read Alderson’s comments – and it is going to make a lot of people pretty mad when known

  192. FlBucco says:

    ++++

  193. Jandy says:

    AW, you may not consider me your friend, but I do consider you mine.
    That’s the way I roll.

    I also find it offensive how some gang up on others.

    But I’ll tell ya what.

    I’ll try to tone it down, if the others do.

    I’m not naming names. Just want to move on.

    Have a good day, friend :)

    (Sincere smile)

  194. Jandy says:

    rriba Wilver
    April 18, 2014 at 11:31 PM

    I agree with you Jandy that anyone who gives it some thought knows what’s going on here. But I’m pretty sure we think those conclusions are very different.

    We aren’t friends. That would be continuing the fake nature of what’s going on.

    Jandy
    April 19, 2014 at 11:19 AM

    AW, you may not consider me your friend, but I do consider you mine.
    That’s the way I roll.

    I also find it offensive how some gang up on others.

    But I’ll tell ya what.

    I’ll try to tone it down, if the others do.

    I’m not naming names. Just want to move on.

    Have a good day, friend :)

    (Sincere smile)

  195. Arriba Wilver says:

    “Jandy
    April 18, 2014 at 10:42 PM
    I started no trend, AW, but when ANYONE here tries to “buck” the trend, this is what gets started … again…by you.”

  196. DJ says:

    AW @ 10:02 a.m.

    No apology needed to me.

    On the completely unrelated topic of my post a few days ago which you mention, I wish you had replied at the time. I had called Jandy the “gatekeeper of the blog” about two years ago when I first started posting and then switched her name to Jandhi in recognition of her Mother Theresa (former) / “spiritual leader” / “conscience of the blog” roles. That’s how I view her. I really enjoy her contributions, as well as those by others (except Milo) too numerous to mention.

    The specific post you reference was in reaction to me logging on late in the day and seeing what had occurred earlier. I did not view my post as a wholesale endorsement of everything Jandhi had said or to whom, only that she had struggled mightily thoughout the day to bring a semblance of normalcy, as she often does when things get a little off track. I thought her effort was deserving of praise. Had I written that post again, I would have stated “. . . helluva job ATTEMPTING to instill sanity — as always.” I think she was only modestly successful that particular day (it was an ugly one), but she tried at least.

    On being a “hockey guy,” it’s my favorite sport in adulthood — no question. But like probably most of those who post here, grew up loving basketball (favorite to play), baseball and football as well. No one trick pony here. However, the stats part of baseball I’m still learning thanks to all you “baseball guys.”

    And thanks for all your contributions to this blog as well, AW.

  197. FlBucco says:

    You forgot they refused to play in the Abreu lottery

    AL rookie of the year…

  198. FlBucco says:

    Davis is not worth anyone in the top 10 – that being said my guess has been Jacoby Jones – high upside – good athletes – and probably ML ready next year.

  199. DJ says:

    Well there’s no humor if no one reads it.

    Hey, I’ve seen some of your very best lines “go to waste” because there were no replies. Just know that I’ve read them all, laughed and then intentionally not replied only because I don’t want it going to your head.

  200. Arriba Wilver says:

    Thanks again, DJ. And no problem here whatsoever. Just to be clear (since we’re all walking on eggshells) I certainly didn’t mean the hockey guy reference as a put down. And I’m hardly an expert on baseball, it’s just the boyhood sport I’ve always loved and followed most closely, so I’m pretty confident in my history there.

    I’ve actually been to lots of Pens games, including “whiteout” playoff games. But I’m embarrassed to admit, I still can’t follow the penalties. A whistle is blown and I’m like “what?”

  201. JD says:

    MLB channel, I think.

  202. JD says:

    Good luck AW.

  203. Daquido_Bazzini says:

    No name has been given, but Jon Heyman is reporting that it is a 2013 draft pick.

  204. tdb1977 says:

    No, its on MLB Network in the Pittsburgh market.

  205. Thundercrack says:

    Thanks. And I would suppose that it will be the Brewers’ announcers. Gotta take what you can get

  206. Thundercrack says:

    Some baseball news …from twitter
    ‘Ludwick will likely miss a few days. Fouled one off his big toe yesterday. X-rays were negative.’

    That dude can’t stay healthy and seems to get injured in the most ‘brittle’ type of ways.

  207. Milo Hamilton says:

    Of course word coming from the Mets side has the PTBNL being the “key piece” to the deal. Remember how this works, the guy the farthest away from the majors is always the “key piece”.

  208. Arriba Wilver says:

    Like Bryan Morris? ;-) (duck)

  209. Thundercrack says:

    I like to think of it that way. It helps me take my mind off the notion that Andy LaRoche was the key piece to that deal.

  210. Milo Hamilton says:

    You do remember. See, it hasn’t been that long. The NY media with the help of some strategically planted info will have whoever it is being the second coming of Babe Ruth.

  211. Baywatch says:

    So … I was thinking it was just my computer that wasn’t refreshing to a FRESH Saturday thread. Afternoon, All … though it’s still morning here in East Texas. Is IKE DAVIS in the batting cage with Clint yet? Maybe Ray Searage can do something for him since his Daddy was a pitcher … DID SOMEONE KNOCK THE COVER OFF THE BALL LAST NIGHT? LOL!

  212. Bizrow says:

    Barrett Barnes is on the 7 day DL, thats another name to think about regarding PTBNL

  213. Thundercrack says:

    I just got this notification from At-Bat:

    Pirates reinstate Chris Stewart from the 15 day DL. Option Tony Sanchez to Triple A

  214. Bizrow says:

    Thanks

    Any word on when Ike will arrive?

  215. Baywatch says:

    I hate giving up our prospects for BROKEN We-Don’t-Have-A-Ray Searage Answer-For-That things.

  216. Thundercrack says:

    Bay, your comment is going to start a ‘ NH saves all his prospects/loves his prospects/is only concerned with the minor leagues’ debate. :-)

    And I think we should wait to see what the quality of the prospects is

  217. twentytwo22 says:

    I hope he is Adam LaRoche Pt 2.

  218. Baywatch says:

    Emphasis HERE is on the broken pseudo-established player.

  219. Baywatch says:

    Or, maybe he slips nicely into our remake of “Platoon.” I’m cool with that. I really hope he does well, of course.

  220. Baywatch says:

    THE RIVERHOUNDS-KICKERS THREAD IS UP!!!! :-)

  221. The Gunner says:

    Chris Stewart is finally activated; Tony Sanchez optioned to Indy.

  222. Sisyphus says:

    Just last season the Pirates got pretty much average production out of first base. Their OPS was only .004 below league average for first basemen. Their first basemen had OPS over .800 in 1981, 1982, 1986, 1996, 1999 and 2007. So who is trying to whitewash history?

    Have a nice day.

  223. Andrew says:

    Lineup has Davis batting sixth, Tabata fifth.

  224. Baywatch says:

    Woo-Hoo! And we take a commercial break to inform that Evan Meek is on for the Orioles to try to stem the Red Sox tide … somewhat unsuccessfully at first (that’s Japanese for a run scored, but it wasn’t HIS!)

  225. theplanisworking says:

    Quit talking about me on Easter Weekend, please. ;)

  226. Chuck H says:

    Can a team have an automatic out in the cleanup spot in the lineup? In Friday’s game, he left a lot of runners stranded on the base paths. He seems to think that he has to swing for the fences every time he is up with runners in scoring position. The truth is: A single or double would do just fine in a situation with men in scoring position.
    Let’s bench him for awhile and let him think about it, or, better yet, yank him for a pinch-hitter when called for.
    GO, BUCS!!!

  227. Chuck H says:

    Yes, Bay, a batter did actually knock the cover off the ball. There ought to be a rule somewhere in the book, that the batter be ordered to bat over with the same ball and strike count. That was damaged goods that was thrown to the batter and should have been called so by the HP ump.

 
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